28th June, 1947
A few days back a meeting of the Vysya Sangam was held in this town. A number of prominent Vysyas from Andhra State attended it. Two days back all of them came to the Ashram in the morning and one of the chief men amongst them addressed Bhagavan thus: “Swami, God has become jiva. Will the grief that the jiva suffers affect God or not?”
Bhagavan did not give a reply immediately but remained silent. The questioner waited for a while and asked, “Swami, shall I wait until you give me a reply?” “Who is it that is asking the question?” said Bhagavan. “A jiva,” he said.
“Who is that jiva? What does he look like? Where was he born? Where does he get dissolved? If you enquire and find out, he who is known as jiva will be found to be God himself.
Then it will be known whether the grief experienced by the jiva will affect God or not. When that is known, there will be no trouble at all.”
“That is what we are unable to know,” said the questioner.
“There is no effort required to know one’s self. You exist during sleep but all the things in the world that you see are not visible then. When you wake up you see everything. But you existed then and exist now (during sleep and while awake). That which comes on you in your wakeful state should be thrown out,” said Bhagavan.
“How are we to throw it out?” enquired the other.
“If you remain as you are, it will go out of its own accord. Your nature is to be. If you see the Reality as it is, the unreal will go away as unreal”, said Bhagavan.
“What is the method by which this can be seen?” asked the questioner.
“By enquiring ‘Who am I?’ and ‘What is my true state?’” said Bhagavan. “How am I to enquire?” asked that questioner. Bhagavan kept silent.
The questioner waited for a reply for a while and then, saying, “Yes, this is the method,” he touched the feet of Bhagavan despite the objections of the attendants and went away with all the members of the Vysya Sangam.
After they had left, Bhagavan said to those sitting near him, “Don’t they know the reply? They just wanted to test me. They felt that their work was over, when they touched my feet. What more do they require?”
A rich Reddy from Nellore who happened to be there said, “Ananda is said to be Atma. Ananda is free from sorrow.
If so, when the jiva experiences ananda, will he be free from sorrow?”
Bhagavan replied, “There can be ananda (joy) only if there is duhkha (sorrow). It is only if a thing is known as duhkha then ananda can be known. If duhkha is not realised, how can ananda be realised? So long as there is one who knows, these two will exist. Vastu (the thing that is) is above sukha and duhkha. Even so, that vastu is known as sukha because Sat is above sat and asat. Jnana is above jnana and ajnana, Vidya is above vidya and avidya. The same thing is said about several other things. So what is there to say?” said Bhagavan. The same idea is expressed in stanza ten of “Unnadhi Nalupadhi”.